States (without the intervention of a third nation) of those productions, with which each could furnish the other. We can furnish to France (because we have heretofore furnished to England) of whale oil and spermaceti, of furs and peltry, of ships and naval stores, and of pot ash, to the amount of fifteen millions of livres, and the quantities will admit of increase. Of our tobacco, France consumes the value of ten millions more.

Twenty-five millions of livres then mark the extent of that commerce of exchange, which is at present practicable between us. We want, in return, productions and manufactures, not money. If the duties on our produce are light, and the sale free, we shall undoubtedly bring it here, and lay out the proceeds on the spot, in the productions and manufactures which we want. The merchants of France, will, on their part, become active in the same business. We shall no more think, when we shall have sold our produce here, of making an uselessvoyage to another country, to lay out the money, than we think at present, when we have sold it elsewhere, of coming here to lay out the money. The conclusion is, that there are commodities which form a basis of exchange to the extent of a million of guineas annually; it is for the wisdom of those in power, to contrive that the exchange shall be made.

Having put this paper into the hands of Monsieur Reyneval, we entered into conversation again on the subject of the farms, which were now understood to be approaching to a conclusion. He told me, that he himself was decidedly of opinion, that the interest of the State required the farm of tobacco to be

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discontinued; that he had, accordingly, given every aid to my proposition, which laid within his sphere. That Count de Vergennes was very clearly of the same opinion, and had supported it strongly with reasons of his own, when he transmitted it to the Comptroller General; but that the Comptroller, in the discussions of this subject, which had taken place, besides the objections which the Count de Vergennes had repeated to me, and which are beforementioned, had added, that the contract with the Farmers General, was now so far advanced, that the article of tobacco could not be withdrawn from it, without unravelling the whole transaction.

Having understood, that in this contract, there was always reserved to the crown a right to discontinue it at any moment, making just reimbursements to the Farmers, I asked M. Reyneval, if the contract should be concluded in its present form, whether it might still be practicable to have it discontinued, as to the article of tobacco, at some future moment. He said it might be possible.

Upon the whole, the true obstacle to this proposition has penetrated in various ways through the veil which covers it.

The influence of the Farmers General has heretofore been found sufficient to shake a Minister in his office. Monsieur de Calonne's continuance or dismission has been thought for some time to be on a poise. Were he to shift this great weight, therefore, out of his own scale into that of his adversaries, it would decide their preponderance. The joint interests of France and America, would be an insufficient counterpoise in his favor.

It will be observed, that these efforts to improve the

commerce of the United States, have been confined to that branch only, which respects France itself, and that nothing passed on the subject of our commerce with the West Indies, except an incidental conversation as to our fish.

The reason of this was no want of a due sense of its importance. Of that I am thoroughly sensible. But efforts in favor of this branch would, at present, be desperate. To nations with which we have not yet treated, and who have possessions in America, we may offer a free vent of their manufactures in the United States, for a full or a modified admittance into those possessions.

But to France we were obliged to give that freedom for a different compensation, to wit: for her aid to affect our independence.

It is difficult, therefore, to say what we have now to offer her for an admission into her West Indies. Doubtless it has its price. But the question is, what this would be, and whether worth our while to give it. Were we to propose to give to each other's citizens all the right of natives, they would of course count what they should gain by this enlargement of right, and examine whether it would be worth to them as much as their monopoly of their West Indian commerce. If not, that commercial freedom which we wish to preserve, and which indeed is so valuable, leaves us little else to offer.

An expression in my letter to the Count de Vergennes, of November 20th, wherein I hinted that both nations might, perhaps, come into the opinion that the condition of natives might be a better ground of intercourse for their citizens than that of the most favored nation, was intended to furnish an opportunity to the Minister of par

leying on that subject, if he was so disposed, and to myself, of seeing whereabouts they would begin, that I might communicate it to Congress, and leave them to judge of the expediency of pursuing the subject.

But no overtures have followed; for I have no right to consider as coming from the Minister, certain questions, which were very soon after proposed to me by an individual.

It sufficiently accounts for these questions that that individual had written a memorial on the subject for the consideration of the Minister, and might wish to know what we would be willing to do. The idea that I should answer such questions to him, is equally unaccountable, we suppose them originating with himself, or coming from the Minister.

In fact, I must suppose them to be his own; and I transmit them only that Congress may see, what one Frenchman at least thinks on the subject.

If we can obtain from Great Britain reasonable conditions of commerce, (which in my idea must forever include an admission into her islands,) the freest ground between the two nations would seem to be the best. But if we can obtain no equal terms from her, perhaps Congress might think it prudent, as Holland has done, to connect us unequivocally with France.

Holland has purchased the protection of France. The price she pays is aid in time of war. It is interesting for us to purchase a free commerce with the French islands. But whether it is best to pay for it by aids in war, or by privileges in commerce, or not to purchase it all, is the question.

FROM BARON DE THULEMEIER TO THOMAS JEFFERSON.

Sir,

Translation.

The Hague, October 11, 1785.

I have the pleasure to inform you of the receipt of the ratification of the treaty of commerce and amity, which I have had the satisfaction of negotiating with yourself and colleagues. When that of the United States of America comes to hand, I shall hasten to concert with you, the most proper means for the customary exchange, in transactions of this kind.

If Mr. Short is still with you, I must request you, sir, to remember my respects to him, and assure him that I consider myself under great obligations to you, for the opportunities you afforded me of becoming acquainted with him. Mr. Short appeared to me as no less distinguished by his knowledge and information, than by his abilities in the management of business.

I have the honor to be, &c.

DE THULEMEIER.

P. S. May I ask the favor of you to forward to Baltimore the enclosed letter which has been sent to me by a merchant of Silesia.

FROM THOMAS JEFFERSON TO THE BARON DE THULEMEIER. Paris, October 16, 1785.

Sir,

I am to acknowledge the receipt of the letter of the 11th instant, with which you have honored me, and where